A Revolutionary Jesus: Shifting Paradigms in Faith with Terry Whalin

Terry Whalen about his transformative faith journey. 

Growing up in the church, Terry initially believed he understood Christianity, but it was during his college years at Indiana University that his perspective shifted significantly. 

After a profound encounter with a fellow student, a visit to a small bookstore, and a commitment to read the Bible, Terry's faith deepened, leading him to join the Wycliffe Bible Translators. 

His experience, including work in Guatemala, reflects a story of spiritual awakening and the impactful power of personal conviction.

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Transcript

Jan: Okay, welcome everyone, to Just Talking About Jesus. I have Terry Whalen here with me today. Welcome, Terry.

Terry: Jan. Wonderful to be here with you.

Jan: Yeah,

I am kind of excited to hear your story. I mean, every time I start a podcast, it's just like, oh, where is God going to take this? This is so fun to see.

See what it's got.

So you had an encounter way back with maybe when you were in college with a small group,

and it kind of changed your perspective of what maybe church and Christianity was about. You want to tell us about that?

Terry: Yeah. You know, I.

I thought I grew up in the church, Jan. I thought I was a Christian, baptized at a young age, all that kind of thing. We were in the church pretty much anytime the doors were open there to, to be at Chur Church.

But I decided to go to Indiana University to study journalism.

And I got on the big campus there, 30,000 students on the main campus, and I basically got lost as far as my, my beliefs go, which is pretty easy to do in a situation like that.

I,

I joined a social fraternity. I started going out drinking with my college buddies,

and I'd been out really late one night and I couldn't get my fingers on the right keys. I was writing for the campus newspaper, the Daily Student. And I was sitting there, my old royal typewriter,

and just couldn't, get the right keys out.

And every time I made a mistake, I kept muttering to myself, Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ.

And this little blonde-haired girl that was sitting next to me.

There were about 30 of us sitting there all pounding our stories out.

And she looked at me and she said, oh, Terry, don't say that about Jesus, because one of these days when you really need Jesus, you'll call out for him and he won't be there.

And I thought, what's this? I'm a Christian. I go to church when I'm at home. I read the Bible in church when I'm at home.

I had, I had really no personal relationship at all, Jan. And so she encouraged me to go to this little bookstore a couple blocks off the Indiana campus.

They had pretty cards and posters and maybe I'd find a book that interested me. So I wandered down there a couple days later and I bought this book called Jesus the Revolutionary.

I thought, how in the world could Jesus be a revolutionary?

And at that time in my life, I was rebelling from, you know, my upbringing and my faith and all that. So I took this little book back to my room and I read this book and it showed Me a different side of Jesus than I'd ever seen before.

He was more than a praying figure in the garden of Gethsemane or raising a hand and blessing kids or something like that. He was real.

About that time,

some people invited me to this little Jesus people gathering in downtown Bloomington.

They were sitting on scraps of carpets with little candles lit.

And those people in that room had something that I didn't have.

And so I got a.

Got a Bible.

Changed the direction of my life.

I mean, back then I was planning on being a newspaper reporter, so I was training to work at the Indianapolis Star or the Chicago Tribune, one of those kind of places.

And instead I joined this group called Wycliffe Bible Translators.

My.

My journalism colleagues thought I was totally nuts because that's what we were all training to do, was to.

To go. Go write stories.

And instead I tripped off to Guatemala, Central America.

Worked among the Southwest, Catchy cow people.

Made a lot of different decisions in my life.

Actually have a master's in linguistics out of working down there and left. Left a lot of my writing behind back then. But then I. Then I wandered back to my writing,

started writing magazine articles, and that's kind of where I've been ever since.

Jan: Interesting how God takes us from one little thing to the next. When you were with that group that sounds like a 70s group.

Terry: It was, it was. It was actually in the 70s. And,

you know, the Jesus people movement was, Was big back then, and people were coming to. Coming to Christ and I,

I was right there in the middle of all that.

Jan: Yeah. Yeah, it was kind of the. Did you have the. I found a bumper sticker?

Terry: I did, I did. I actually worked on the I Found it campaign and was. Was a counselor on, on that, that whole campaign and everything. Yeah.

Jan: Back then,

what were some of the things when you started reading the Bible, what were some of the things that. That really struck you or opened your mind to. To really more who Jesus was?

Terry: Well,

I was. I was captured by the, by the stories and the,

you know, the whole, the whole gospel message. And, and it, it really. It really just. Just changed my life. And so I was.

I started reading the Bible every day and having devotions and really changed. Changed what I was, what I was doing all the way around as far as. Yeah, I moved out of my fraternity.

That didn't seem like the right place to be,

so I didn't stay with those guys, but instead I, I joined a. A group on the campus and,

you know, went. Went with them and learned about,

you know, how to Share my faith and all that kind of thing. So it, it totally, totally transformed what I was, what I was going to do back then.

Jan: I just think it's fascinating just to hear where people change their paradigm. You know, I mean, you're going along and you're just not thinking about things and all of a sudden there's like God plants a little somebody or something that just opens the door and it's just like he must have known that you were ready for that,

you know, at that time.

Terry: Yeah, no, absolutely. And, and that, that little blonde haired girl that was sitting next to me is still one of my friends, you know, even after all this time, 50 years later, you know, we're still checking in with each other and, and all that.

So those relationships that you form early on can be something that really lasts through, through all the years, which is.

Jan: Amazing because you also, not only are they watching you grow, you're watching them and feeding into their lives as well. And there's absolutely.

Terry: And I, I still have that little book here. It is called Jesus the Revolutionary and it's, it's all yellow now and very, very old little book that I have. But I still kept this book.

So that's,

it's, it's been an important, important part of my life.

Jan: So as you're, this is a curious question.

So as a journalist,

as you're reading the Bible,

did your mind kind of go like how you would have written it or how you the, the accounts or how you would have reported on them?

Terry: No, I've, I've never really wanted to do that. I have,

you know, I've written some devotions and some things,

some thoughts that I have about the Bible out of, out of all that.

So I have, I have done a few of those, those kind of books through the years. But as a kid I was always fascinated with,

with people's stories and I think that's part of why I became a, a storyteller and a journalist.

As a kid I read a lot of biographies and so now as an adult I've, I've written all kinds of biographies about people's lives like,

like Billy Graham and Luis Palau and Billy Sunday and a lot of those kind of people because I believe their stories are, are very important to, to capture those stories and, and pass those on to other people.

Jan: Yeah, fascinating. When my first husband had a book that was.

Can't even think the name of it. I think I even have it still, but it was something called Chronicles or something. It's a great big book, but it was written in a journalistic style of recording the events of the Bible and whatever, anyway, because he was interested in writing as well.

But it was kind of a different take on, on how things.

Things are like that. So they probably could have been snippets in Instagram, you know.

Terry: Yeah, they could have been. There's. There's a lot of different versions of the Bible. And so I've always been fascinated with that, that kind of thing. And I read in different versions.

I don't know if you've ever seen. There's a, there's even a southern version of the Bible that was done called.

It's. Well, the, the Gospel of Luke is called Jesus Doings and Happenings.

And it's in. Instead of,

you know, the Jews and the Gentiles, it has the north and the south, you know, and it, and it.

All these,

all these little colloquialisms are in, in that book. It's a very, very different kind of Bible translation.

Jan: Be kind of fun to read, actually.

Terry: Yeah, it is. It. It's different.

Jan: Yeah, it's different. So tell us more about the. Your experiences with Wycliffe.

Terry: Yeah, I committed my life to,

to worldwide evangelism as a part of what I did in college. We went to this,

this gathering called Urbana that was. Was in Urbana, Illinois. And so at the final service of that,

that thing, you.

You stood and committed your life to world evangelism. And that's what I did back then.

And so I looked at all these different missions and different ministries when I was there at Urbana.

And the one that really stood out to me,

and it's because I had a personal relationship with it was, was Wycliffe Bible Translators.

My.

One of my friends in college, his.

His parents were Bible translators down in Peru.

And I was always intrigued with this guy. He was a different kind of guy. Even in the wintertime in Indiana, he didn't wear socks. He always wore sandals.

And so, you know, that, that made him stand out, as you can imagine, just, just there in the snow and all that kind of stuff. But I was fascinated with those experiences about how important it was to, to be able to give the Bible to people that didn't have it in their.

In their own language. And so that's, that's why I was drawn to Wycliffe Bible Translators and why I worked. Worked in Guatemala those years and everything.

Jan: We've been to Guatemala seven different times. We work with unbound that has sponsored kids. And so we've got a number of families down there, so real familiar With Kachta.

Terry: Well, I was down there during some of the most violent years. I'm sure looking back. My parents wondered why in the world I would. Going off and doing this. But,

you know, we were, we were cautious. We didn't go out at night and stuff like that. But it was, it was some of.

During some of the most violent years in, In Guatemala, people were getting killed left and right by the, by the gorillas and all kinds of things. But,

you know, we felt called to be there. And God. God honored our work. I actually have a,

a book on my shelf that wouldn't call it the Kachikel New Testament. That's in, it's in Spanish and Kachikal, which is one of the, One of the Mayan languages in Guatemala.

This book wouldn't have existed, Jan, if I hadn't made those kind of choices back then.

And so I'm very, very glad that I, that I made those kind of choices and that that book is, is in existence and people are still using it out there, which is great.

Jan: So how did you actually work on the translations?

Terry: We actually worked on the early, the early, early days, more of the language linguistics part. And then we trained the translators and worked with them, who actually ended up finishing finishing New Testament, and then we back went back in.

In. I think it was in 1990.

Yeah, that's when, that's when this was dedicated to go back, to dedicate the New Testament with them and everything.

Jan: So as a man of stories, what stories do you have about the impacts while you were down there?

Terry: Oh,

I, I think it's amazing because as I would talk to people in, in Kachikel, I was. That's the language that we were learning back then.

They would, they would look on the surface like they were bilingual, like they spoke Spanish and all that, but they, they said, oh, no, we don't.

I mean, we kind of speak Spanish, but our language really is Kachiquel. And so I think it's, it's getting the, the scriptures into that heart language that people speak, you know, as they sit around their kitchens and all that kind of thing, that's, that's the difference maker.

I think that happens in people's lives once they,

once they hear it in their, in their own language.

Mm. Mm.

Jan: Do you have any memory of, of specific people who, you know, and their reactions, other than, you know, just feeling validated, for sure. But, you know, just how, how maybe that changed them?

Terry: Well,

I can think of.

I mean, one of the guys we worked with day in and day out was was Flavio Tai.

And he would. He would talk about how he. Sure, he spoke some Spanish, but it was really his own language that really made the difference. And having the scriptures in his own language was really precious to him.

And I. I think those of us that have it all the time we have it. We have our Bibles all the time. We. We lose track of those people like this that don't have it and what it really can mean to them.

And so I think.

I think that can serve as a. As.

As not a warning necessarily, but just as a example for us to see that.

Sure,

we need to be reading our own Bibles every day and looking at those stories and seeing how that applies in our lives,

because there's so many people out there around the world that don't have that opportunity.

Mm. Mm.

Jan: Yeah.

What do you think about.

I mean, I would think now it'd be way easier to translate just because of AI Just. Let's. Let's delve into the. The AI a little bit AI world a little bit here.

I mean, do you think that that does somebody. If, If AI was used to translate,

is there a human that goes back and says, yeah, this is right, or no?

Terry: Yes, there is. There's. There's a human that has to check it all and make sure that it's all right. It. It's not just simply a machine to machine type of. Type of translation.

But you're right.

The whole translation world has changed a lot with all this. And it's.

It's getting rapid. I mean, I mean, the scriptures tell us that every.

Every person on the planet, before God comes back, before the Lord returns,

will hear the scriptures in their own language.

And so I think Wycliffe and their work is. Is definitely a part of that whole movement. I mean, people have thought it's the last days,

Jan, since. Since Jesus left. So, you know, we've all been thinking it's the last days,

but,

you know, that was 2,000 years ago. So, you know, we're. We got to be getting closer to it. However it works out, every day is.

Jan: Definitely getting closer because there's a definite time when it's. When that he knows is going to happen.

So, tell me about other ways that God has built your character.

Terry: Oh, my. My character's been built through the years with.

With all kinds of unexpected experiences that have happened in my life.

So for. For example,

I'm one of the few journalists that have actually ever. Ever interviewed Chuck Swindoll. I. I had lunch with. With Pastor Chuck,

and he doesn't need the. He doesn't need the media and doesn't. Doesn't like them a lot of times because they're not prepared when they talk to him and all that kind of stuff.

I took a different tack. I actually showed him my story about him before.

Before it was published, and he said, oh,

the journalists never do that, Terry. But. But I did, because I wanted it to make sure it was accurate, and it was something that sounded like the way he would sound.

But I just had this amazing experience with him, Jan, because,

you know, he. He was just so transparent with me about how in the body of Christ, there are no heroes.

He said, you know, we're all like a bunch of guys in the back of a pickup truck trying to get our stuff together.

And I try to think of that, you know, no matter who I meet, whether I. Whether I meet somebody famous like tuxwindall, or whether it's just somebody that crosses my path in my daily experiences.

And I think each of these people that I met with, like, that have built just incredible experiences into my life and how I'm responding to others and all the. All those kinds of things.

So I think each of those experiences built. Built character into my life,

even the life journey that I've been on.

I mean, I.

I went through a divorce years ago,

you know, which was hard. I mean, I was. I was a missionary, and then,

you know, I suddenly got served divorce papers, and so I had to. Had to deal with all that kind of thing.

But I've been. I've been remarried now for over 30 years.

And so,

you know, each of those experiences that we have in our life build that kind of. Kind of character into our experiences and how we. How we respond to the world.

Absolutely.

Jan: And I think I have a friend who has a podcast called Eternal Echoes,

and she only interviews older people just because she wants to know what their experiences were and what they had gained from, you know, what God's done with them in their lives and how that could benefit younger people.

And anyway, I love them.

They're really fascinating, you know, to hear just how. How God builds your character. You know, I mean, you start at one point, and, I mean, you're gonna have something building your character one way or another,

but look how rich it is, you know, when it's. When it's a godly character, right?

Terry: Oh, absolutely. And those experiences,

good and bad, that I've had in my life have built. Built just incredible kinds of kinds of things. I mean, I've.

I've had the opportunity through the years, I've. I've interviewed and written stories about, you know, more than 150 bestselling authors. And so just. Just that opportunity alone was. Was huge in my own life.

I mean, I wrote this biography about Billy Graham. I actually worked for Billy Graham about 35 years ago. I was associate editor at Decision magazine back when the office was in Minneapolis.

We were doing 1.518 million copies of the magazine every.

Every issue.

I mean,

this little nondescript building set of buildings in, In Minneapolis. People had no idea, but they would pull six or seven semis full of mail out of that place every day.

I mean, it was. It was phenomenal what was going on there.

And I had the opportunity to,

to work with those people. I.

I traveled to Managua, Nicaragua. I covered Franklin Graham's first overseas crusade.

I was there with about a dozen people,

watched to see how all that. All that kind of thing worked.

And it built a lot into my. Into my character, but my personal life as well as I, as I watched, watched that. It was a little standup crusade downtown Managua, Jan.

That we were.

We were having. And, you know, Franklin had never worked with an interpreter before. I mean, at this point in his life now, he's a. He's a great experienced speaker, and people recognize him and all that kind of thing.

But back then, he was a young guy, you know, working with a. His first translator.

And so as an evangelist, they always say, you know, tonight I'm going to ask you to make a decision. And, well, when he said that kind of words,

people started surging forward to accept Christ.

And he.

He was inexperienced. He didn't know what to do.

So he looked around and the crusade director was sitting right behind him. He tugged on the back of his suit. He said, give the invitation, Franklin. And so, you know, Franklin had this big, thick book.

You know, his daddy taught him to, to put his sermon like that. And so he flipped to the back,

prayed,

turned, closed his book, turned around and left, which is he was supposed to do.

And I stood there for hours afterwards. People were surging forward and accepting Christ. You know, I mean, it was.

It was phenomenal to see that kind of thing.

And I've had those kind of experiences throughout my life that changed because. Because I bought this. I bought this little book called Jesus the Revolutionary, you know.

Jan: Yeah.

Terry: I mean, it's unbelievable to me.

Jan: Yeah, Just those little paths that God takes you on and then who, who you encounter and how that changes. And, you know, you're obviously a relationship type person,

you know, which to me, that's the best thing in the world is building relationships and,

and having all of that, you know.

Terry: Yeah,

well, we need each other.

And so we, we really have to have to figure out how to connect to other people and then help them in any way, in any way that we can. I mean,

years ago,

when, when blogging started, for example, I.

I started writing this little blog about the writing life that I have, and I just kept doing it.

And that's. I think that. I think that's one of the keys if you're trying to figure out how to,

how to build relationships, you know, start something and then persevere with it is. Is a key lesson, I think.

And so for my blog, I just kept writing these little blog articles once a week and putting them out there.

Well, now, Jan, my blog has over 1800 entries in it,

and I have this thing that goes out and searches for my name online. About a year, a couple years ago, I found this article that said there were over 600 million blogs that are out there.

But this article listed the top 27 content producers.

And I was one of those 27.

And it's not that I'm doing anything fancy. I'm just blocking every week.

Jan: Yeah, yeah, you're being consistent.

Terry: Yeah, being consistent. And that,

that ability to persevere and be consistent, I think is one of the, one of the keys to,

to finding your own way and your own niche out there in the world.

Jan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'd agree with that totally. Yeah. What, at this point in your life brings you the most joy?

Terry: Well, you know, there's a number of things that bring joy to my life, but one of the, one of the great joys that I have is I'm still an acquisitions editor in New York Publishing house, so I'm still working with authors.

They say that at any point in time, there's over a million submissions that are in circulation on people's desks and agents and editors and all that.

So I have the opportunity as an editor that's worked in all kinds of books through the years to,

you know, mentor and help these writers that I'm dealing with, whether they ultimately publish with Morgan James or not.

You know, that's, that's their choice. But I'm doing my part to help guide them understand that,

you know, their book has to be for a particular market and it has to be shaped in a certain kind of way for it to go. People don't understand that I mean,

I have people that pitch me children's books, for example, and they say, my book is for every child.

Well,

no, you know, if. If you know anything at all about the children's market, you know, I mean, it's. There's. There's a three to six market.

There's a six to eight. You know, there's. You. You have to fit your book into those categories.

Jan: Yeah.

Terry: Otherwise,

you know, bookstores and librarians, they don't know what to do with your book. So if you don't know that, you're just gonna trip around out there and get rejected forever if you don't really fit into what's going on in the market.

So I have that opportunity to sort of mentor authors and help them figure out where to fit and how to get their book out there. And so it's been exciting to me to be able to have that opportunity with different authors.

Jan: Yeah, yeah. Cause you can see. Well, you see their spark, you know, and that. That keeps you going, right?

Terry: It does. It does. And,

you know, there's. There's people that are working on Christian books, children's books, devotionals,

nonfiction.

I mean, a whole array of different things.

And if. If I can help them figure out how to get their book out there in the right kind of way and reach other people,

then,

you know, I have to grab.

I've done what I'm supposed to do. And that. That does bring me a lot of joy and great, great satisfaction in this process.

Jan: We're almost out of time, but it's almost Thanksgiving. What are you have a few tips about being thankful and showing thankfulness?

Terry: Well,

my tip about Thanksgiving, Jen, would be that the gratitude is not just something that happens once a year,

but really we need to figure out how to incorporate gratitude into our. Into our daily lives.

So I,

I, personally, years ago, I started this.

This daily gratitude journal.

And so I.

I open up a blank journal, and I write several sentences in that every single day just to remind myself to be grateful.

You know, in. In Second Thessalonians,

there's a lot. We were talking about the last days earlier in.

Or. No, it's. It's 2 Timothy. That's where it is. There's 2 Timothy 3. There's a list of terrible sins that happen during the last days.

And in the middle of that, there's this one word that says ungrateful.

And so that's the direction that our world's going. So as. As believers, as Christians,

I feel like we need to walk in a different way and we need to express gratitude throughout our day, not just once a year on Thanksgiving.

Jan: Yeah, yeah. And even things like just, just sending thank you cards or things that are, you know, little notes or things that are uplifting to people to let them know that you value those around you and whatever too.

Right.

Terry: It does, it does. It makes a big difference to get, to get that kind of thing. And so I,

I have a list of, I have a stack of thank you notes that I, that I send. And so I, I,

I pull those out and send one of those throughout the week. Different times.

Jan: Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of a neat little ministry in a way, you know, too.

Terry: It is.

Jan: Terry, thank you. This has really been fun and educational. I love seeing how your walk has been and just the people you've impacted throughout your life and whatever. It's really inspiring.

Terry: Well, I appreciate the opportunity, Jan. And that's why I have my personal email address right in my X Twitter file, right there in my profile. Because I really do want to help people.

So if anybody wants to reach out to me,

take a look at that and reach out to me and see how I can help you, I'd love to do it.

Jan: Oh, that's awesome. Thank you. Stop the recording.