Revelationship with Cathy Gardner

Revelationship book   
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Do you ever wonder how to get close to God?

How to develop a relationship with him?

 Like, people tell you he’s your friend. Your dad. Your brother.

You might have a hard time picturing him in those roles.

Or you might understand him as a distant God, but certainly not as a friend.

Sometimes God seems so far away.

Cathy Colver Garland, oldest daughter of Dr. Randy Colver, has co-authored Revelationship: Transformative Intimacy With Christ, debuting at #1 New Release on Amazon in one of their categories. 

She also writes Graceful Musings, a blog providing women a moment of rest and challenge before those little fingers appear under the bathroom door.
 
A former Vice-President of a software company, she currently consults with institutions and companies on marketing, sales, and strategy. 

She also mentors women in professional, spiritual, and personal development.
 
Saved and living an “absolutely surrendered” life, her passion is to teach people to hear God's voice and obey, surrender their lives absolutely, and walk in freedom.
 
She is married to Mickey and has two children in elementary school.

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Join my Substack @janjohnson3

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Transcript

[00:01] Jan Johnson: Are you looking for an inspiring listen? Something to motivate you? You've come to the right place. Welcome to Women of the Northwest, where we have conversations with ordinary women leading extraordinary lives.

[00:12] Motivating, inspiring, compelling.

[00:18] Cathy Garland: Sure.

[00:18] Jan Johnson: Hey, everybody. Glad you're here. My guest today is Kathy Garland. Kathy, nice to have you here.

[00:24] Cathy Garland: Thank you for having me. I'm excited.

[00:26] Jan Johnson: I know. I am, too. Gosh.

[00:29] We're going to talk about a little bit of your testimony, a little bit about revelationship, which I'm starting to learn how to say, and just a few other things. So, yeah, tell me about your.

[00:45] Your spiritual life. How'd you get started? You know, what's. What you grow into or where were you?

[00:52] Cathy Garland: Absolutely. So I grew up in the church. I was a pastor's daughter, not one of those pastor's daughters that go crazy. I was loving the Lord from the time I was little there.

[01:04] Whenever was a moment when I didn't know his presence. I was raised by hippies, saved in the Jesus movement.

[01:11] And it was a very authentic walk with God.

[01:15] Yes, exactly. My mom literally was saved on a commune. So, you know, she had the fringe Jesus freak purse, the whole thing.

[01:26] The commune was, I believe, actually in Washington, now that I say that. But it might have been when they lived in Alaska because they kind of. They did the Seattle to Anchorage back and forth kind of thing multiple times in her life.

[01:38] Jan Johnson: There's a big one in. Was in southern Oregon.

[01:42] Cathy Garland: Okay. Yeah.

[01:43] Jan Johnson: My husband. Yeah. Thought about joining.

[01:48] Cathy Garland: Yeah. She tells the story. It's fascinating. You know, it's a fascinating time. And if people saw the Jesus movement film, you know, they were playing music and I was like, oh, I know that song.

[01:59] And there was a piano in. And I was like, I learned on that. It was a Kurzweil. I knew that piano. I learned to play piano on that piano. And then they were making things out of popsicle sticks.

[02:10] And I was like, I can make anything out of popsicle sticks. You know, Moses parting the sea, like, whatever you want. I can make it out of popsicle sticks. But the.

[02:19] The thing that stood out to me from that movie the most, that reminded me of what was, I think, lost to the church since then was the casual community where they're sitting around and they're writing songs together for the very first time.

[02:36] They're, you know, probably the very first time they're writing any kind of a lyric that has to do with Jesus instead of drugs, sex and rock and roll. And also when they're sitting in the church on that orange faded Carpet in that church in the movie.

[02:53] I was like, oh, I slept on that carpet. I know that carpet.

[02:57] So that was my upbringing until I was about 13, and the business church model had crept in and kind of taken over. And I think I saw a number of hypocritical things, as is kind of normal, I suppose.

[03:13] And I told my father that I wasn't sure this Christianity thing was for me. So instead of panicking, he took me to the library and we checked out a stack full of books about as tall as I was.

[03:27] I studied it. Multiple religions. Some of them were quick to reject. Others took a little longer. And then by the end of that year, I knew that Jesus Christ was real and that he wanted a relationship with me.

[03:39] And so that was actually the beginning of what I would consider my own walk with God versus growing up in the church.

[03:46] Jan Johnson: Yeah, yeah, that's a. What a great way to do that, you know, to offer you're. You're smart enough to start thinking about this. Let's explore all these other things. And I've always told my kids, you know, I don't want you to believe because I believe.

[04:01] I want you to ask a lot of questions and figure out what you really believe, you know, and make it real instead of not just because of me or not just because, you know, you're hearing that in church.

[04:14] I mean, figure out what you really believe, you know. So, absolutely, I applaud your dad.

[04:20] Then you came up with this name of revelationship. Talk about that. What does that mean?

[04:26] Cathy Garland: So revelationship is actually a word, but we didn't know it at the time. What had happened was my dad was teaching a number of interns at the church sub class in Bible hermeneutics or something like that.

[04:40] And he had asked me to come and teach them a new way I had discovered to study the Bible. So obviously, growing up at the church, I read through the Bible multiple times, but it's always the Old Testament, the begats and the bring this many to sacrifice at this time, and sprinkle here and sprinkle there.

[04:57] It's very dry, dusty, bloodthirsty, you know. And I dreaded reading the Old Testament. It was like, oh, let's just get through it. See, we get to the good part, like around Esther, you know.

[05:09] And so. But I had sat down to start over reading the Bible, and I thought to myself, there's got to be a better way. And I asked the Holy Spirit and he said, look for me in the God who.

[05:25] And so I began to study in especially in Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2, he makes a statement, I am the God who. And it also reveals in other ways, him.

[05:36] His revelation is so thick, especially in those two chapters, that it opened my eyes. I was like, wait a second, I've been doing this all wrong. I need to be looking for the revelation of God, particularly Christ, but the revelation of God in the Old Testament, kind of like in Aslan, the story of Aslan and the lion, the Witch and the wardrobe, the kids need to look for Aslan before they do anything or it's a disaster.

[06:01] So I was like, I'm going to look for Aslan. I'm going to look for God in the Old Testament. Where are you revealing yourself? What are you doing? How are you revealing yourself in different stories?

[06:10] So I was teaching that to the interns, and my dad wrote the revelation was necessary for relationship. And he accidentally kept on going and he wrote Revelationship.

[06:21] And it turns out it's not a word in the Merriam Webster dictionary, but it is a word in the Urban dictionary, which is kind of interesting.

[06:28] Jan Johnson: Interesting. Interesting. Yeah. Isn't that just the way that light bulb moment, like, oh, oh, oh. Okay, I get this. Like your eyes are opened all of a sudden to how that's really supposed to be.

[06:42] Cathy Garland: Exactly. Yeah.

[06:43] Jan Johnson: This time, reading through our church is reading the Bible project plan with it through the year. But this time in my Bible, I have been underlining or highlighting all the characters of God.

[06:57] You know, places where he was speaking in the Old Testament, but his character and all of that says to go back to. It's.

[07:05] Yeah. Trying to get that little bit more depth on there. Yeah. So you talk a little bit about prayer. Tell me about how you pray and how you build that relationship through prayer.

[07:18] Cathy Garland: All right. So in prayer, one of the things that happened for me was I became a mother. And I can't say I really knew how to pray in a way that would get answers.

[07:30] Not that you manipulate God and that he gives you answers. Could you pray a certain way? But I was really praying more like a machine gun. And I just was kind of standing back and spraying and hoping that one of the bullets was going to hit the heart of God.

[07:44] And that was the one that he was going to grant for me. You know, it was just really sort of haphazard. And I had the faith, very small faith that comes from that sort of haphazard prayer.

[07:54] And so when I became a mom, my children were in great health, but it made me grateful for their health. I began to pray for mothers whose Children are not in good health, particularly.

[08:07] There was a real spate of children born with heart defects at the time that I knew or knew of or had relationship with their family somehow. And. And also in Facebook, there are numbers of mothers, groups that are begging for prayer, like pray specifically for these things.

[08:27] And I hadn't prayed specifically because I think I was afraid that maybe God was not listening to me. And so then I could prove that he wasn't answering my prayer.

[08:36] So I learned to pray specifically.

[08:39] And it was things like, for example, a mom might write, hey, pray that their A1C comes up or that the urine output is at a certain level. I am not a nurse.

[08:49] I do not know these things. And so I would get on my knees and I would say, lord, what do you say about this situation?

[08:58] And I would listen, and my ears began to be trained to hear his voice so specifically that he would tell me what number he wanted the A1C to come up to.

[09:10] And I would pray that specifically in full confidence that was going to happen because he told me to pray it.

[09:16] Jan Johnson: Yeah.

[09:16] Cathy Garland: And it was amazing how my faith just went from nothing really to just this mountain. It was like, well, if he says to do it, he says to pray it. He's jolly well gonna do what he just wants to do.

[09:28] So I would pray it. It would happen. And my faith just soared. And so learning to pray by listening first and only praying what he said to pray, that was a lesson and nothing more and nothing less changed my prayer life entirely.

[09:45] Jan Johnson: Yeah, well, and of course, to even think that he wasn't going to listen to your specific prayers. I mean, who knows you intimately, right?

[09:57] You know and knows. Knows the desires of our hearts, all of that. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's. That's a good word. Good word. What about identity? Let's talk about identity.

[10:07] Cathy Garland: Yeah. So for me, personally, I think my understanding of identity came when he spoke to me. It was a long situation and I was miserable and found myself divorced, even though I did everything right.

[10:24] You know, it's just one of those miserable situations. And he spoke to me and he said, because I was thinking to myself, you know, I really just wish I could just go home, go to heaven.

[10:34] Can you just take me home?

[10:35] And he spoke out the seat of my car, and I heard him for the very first time audibly. I never heard him since audibly, but I about crashed the car.

[10:45] So I almost did go to home to meet him. So that was funny. But he said, if you don't want your life, I do. That's what he said. And so.

[10:54] And I had been a Christian up until this point. I had done my devotions on a daily basis. I had worshiped, I had prayed, I had done all these things.

[11:03] But now I heard his voice. And when he spoke, I. It was. Suddenly I knew which of those voices in my head was my mom's, my dad's, and his, you know, kind of a thing.

[11:13] And so I recognized my.

[11:17] My heart, began to recognize his voice much more. And the very first thing he asked me to surrender, well, first of all was a job, and then a couple other things.

[11:27] And we sort of did this trading thing. If you've ever read Hannah Hernandez Hinds Feet on High Places, she trades things to him. And that gave me a sort of an imagination of what we were doing.

[11:38] And then suddenly he said, I want you to surrender your worst fear.

[11:42] I don't even know. I don't know what my worst fear is. And so I started asking people at the church. I was like, what is your worst fear? What is your worst fear?

[11:50] I mean, some stuff people would say, things like being paralyzed or something like that. And my cousin, who was a daughter of a pastor, too, she said, I think I would be most afraid that God's going to call me to work with cannibals.

[12:06] I suspect there's a lot of pastors, daughters who are a little concerned about that themselves, so. And I said to myself, no, that is not my worst fear. Because if he sent me, I would know that I was sent.

[12:18] And then the Lord spoke to my heart. He says, you are afraid that if you get up on the altar and give me everything, I am not going to notice.

[12:27] That's your worst fear. You're giving me everything, and I'm not going to notice. And so I had. I was shaken. I had to walk outside. And I walked outside and I walked and talked with him.

[12:36] And I said, okay, I surrender this to you, my worst fear. And then he said, now I want everything. And I did what we call absolute. I know I see your face.

[12:47] We call that absolute surrender. And Andrew Murray has a book that's probably the most influential book I've ever read other than the Bible. And I found it just after that.

[12:58] And it said, all that I am. I'm paraphrasing all that I am, all that I'm not, and all that I ever hoped to be, I surrender. Absolutely. That was the change in everything.

[13:10] I can't even tell you. So my identity starts in surrender. So you said identity, but I can't tell you my identity. Until I start with the surrender. Does that make sense?

[13:22] Jan Johnson: Totally. Totally.

[13:23] Cathy Garland: Okay.

[13:24] Jan Johnson: I mean, that's like a baseline, you know, Right?

[13:27] Cathy Garland: Yes.

[13:27] Jan Johnson: And what's the very thing that we're scared to do until we realize, you know, but when you take one step, then it's like, okay, and then the next step isn't so hard, is it?

[13:37] Right.

[13:38] Cathy Garland: Absolutely.

[13:38] Jan Johnson: Because then you know what God's gonna do. Yeah, that's right.

[13:42] Cathy Garland: And then after that, I feel like he reconstructed my faith by, you know, because everybody talks about deconstruction, but he reconstructed my faith by revealing who he is, which then gave me the identity as a receiver of that.

[13:59] So if he is the God who sees me, then I am seen. So now my identity is seen by God. Does that make sense?

[14:09] So it's always this direct result of who he is starting. That's the starting point, which then tells me where my position is in result of that or in light of that.

[14:23] So he's El Shaddai. He provides everything out of the mountain of his absolute riches and substance. He is my sufficiency. Okay. So I am sufficient because of him. So I think that whole question of not being enough that many women struggle with and was certain that would be how I would summarize my worst fear is not being enough to get his attention.

[14:49] I was already not enough for my previous husband. You know, I'm in this situation where people have defined me as not enough, but I am sufficient for what he's calling me to be because he makes me so.

[15:01] Not because of what I have inside of me, but because he makes it so.

[15:06] Jan Johnson: Yeah. And not because of what you do, and not because of somebody who thinks you're something. You know, I always tell people, you know, when they're saying something that is totally not their identity, you know, And I say, whose voice are you listening to?

[15:23] You know, what's that voice that's telling you that specific thing? Because that's not. That's not who you are.

[15:30] You know, it's not who you are. You're right.

[15:33] Cathy Garland: And I think.

[15:34] Jan Johnson: Stop. I think, you know.

[15:37] Cathy Garland: Yeah. I think that today's culture is looking so much for identity because they don't know it starts in Christ. And Christians do say, know your identity in Christ, but we don't know God.

[15:53] And so it's hard to know who you are if you haven't known God. And if you don't know his character. You said you're underlining all his character and his attributes.

[16:04] If you know God, then you can begin to know yourself.

[16:09] Jan Johnson: Yeah. Because we're made in his image.

[16:12] Cathy Garland: That's right.

[16:13] Jan Johnson: Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a whole lot to be said for figuring out your identity, you know, and because once you do, you can rest, you know, you can relax, and you don't feel like you have to.

[16:26] You're not striving to become something you weren't meant to be, you know.

[16:31] Cathy Garland: Right.

[16:32] Jan Johnson: Or to live up to somebody else's what they think or say you are or, you know, whatever your parents or siblings or friends or just the world or Facebook or.

[16:45] Cathy Garland: Right. God forbid.

[16:48] Jan Johnson: Exactly. Yeah, yeah, all of that. So in your book. You wrote a book, right?

[16:55] Cathy Garland: Yes.

[16:56] Jan Johnson: And so are those the basic things that you're covering in there? Is there more? What. What else do you have in there?

[17:01] Cathy Garland: Well, we wrote the book because my second book, which will be coming out in about six months, which is. So the second book is called the God who. And it's based on that way of studying the Bible.

[17:11] It's a study book, but we realize that people don't have a frame of reference necessarily for studying the God who. And receiving or experiencing the revelation of God. And so they might have learned, say, in church to see God or to see him reveal himself, say, in worship or even in the Bible.

[17:32] And. But that might be really all that they've been trained to ever do. But God reveals himself through many different ways. It's the same God. I'm not saying many paths lead to the same God.

[17:43] I'm just saying that there are sacred pathways that the church has recognized and lost maybe in recent generations or maybe some denominations have one of them or two of them, and they might not have the other.

[17:56] So the book is meant to open readers to many of the ways he reveals himself, such as nature. God reveals himself through nature, and it used to be very much a sacred pathway for people to experience.

[18:10] Experience the revelation of God. The scriptures were meant to be read outdoors, and there are people who do not experience the presence of God within four walls. It's a struggle for them, but if they.

[18:24] I even have a couple of friends. Their husbands are hunters, and they will go out and sit in a deer stand for 24 hours and experience God. I'm not sure I would because that's 24 hours, but they do.

[18:39] Jan Johnson: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think everybody's got a different way that they experience them, you know, different. Maybe it's just for me, my, my. Probably the two biggest is when I'm reading the Bible, but also just through worship.

[18:55] Just. That's where I'm Closest and yeah, yeah, to understand.

[19:00] Cathy Garland: I tend to be.

[19:02] I tend to be more of a sensate like that, too. I experience God through worship. My husband experiences the revelation of God through service.

[19:11] That's really his sacred pathway. But everybody I know says, you know, if I do go outside, put my feet in the grass and pray, I will feel his presence. And I think that's absolutely a sacred pathway for experiencing God.

[19:27] Maybe it was rejected because paganism tried to take over. I'm not sure. I mean, paganism is old, but this is not paganism. It's God's creation. And I'm experiencing the Creator and he's revealing himself in creation to me.

[19:42] And there's so many leaders who say, leaders in the church who say that the revelation of God broke upon them as they moved in the forest, you know, or something like that.

[19:54] They have stories of that. And then the Jews used to read the Scripture outside in many cases. So I think that many times we relegate these sacred pathways as not important.

[20:07] And then people go through life thinking they can only experience God in a specific way. And then maybe even start to doubt whether or not he's real or that he cares to reveal Himself to them.

[20:21] But really. So revelationship is. We say it's God revealing himself as he pursues us for relationship. It's all about that relationship. And even suffering is one of the ways that we cover in the book.

[20:35] I don't think we're trained to experience God in suffering. And yet it's really one of the ways. He's so close. It says, the Bible says he sticks closer than a brother.

[20:45] He's the comforter to those who who mourn. But we're not really trained to look for him while we're in the middle of suffering. And if we did, we would find Him.

[20:56] Jan Johnson: However, it's when you're suffering and things aren't going right is when you are more close to God and calling on him more. Because when everything's kind of hunky dory, you're just going day by day and everything's good, you know, I mean, you.

[21:09] Not quite as apt to be. You know, it's when you're questioning things and you want to know and you want to dig deeper and you want to.

[21:17] You want an answer which doesn't always come immediately, but it does bring, you know, I mean, I think. I think those trials and things are meant to bring us closer, you know.

[21:28] Cathy Garland: Absolutely.

[21:29] Jan Johnson: Yeah. They're an avenue for doing that. And I think too, those are the things that you Know, if you listening to somebody's testimony that has.

[21:40] They've had a hard life and a lot of things going on, it's just that sharing the wonder of who God is and back to identity, you know, yeah, that's who I was.

[21:50] But now I'm a new creation and.

[21:53] And who he made me and all of those. Those are the things that are just powerful. And we need to share those things all the time, you know, to just bring some glory, just remind ourselves who he is and that we're not.

[22:05] Sometimes I think we're isolated, you know, I mean, not isolated in, you know, you're with your family and you're with your friends and whatever, but I think you're isolated into.

[22:14] Into your God talk, you know, who you're sharing things with. And if you don't share those things, you may be missing opportunities to be speaking into somebody's life.

[22:26] Cathy Garland: Yes. And when you told me that you live on that west coast, and I, being a Southerner, when I did live there, it was a culture shock to find that many people did not share certain things.

[22:41] And I do think it's not just, you know, parts of the country, but there may be parts of the country who have not shared for so long that generations don't really talk about religion.

[22:50] I know my grandfather, who was from Seattle, he never talked about religion. It was just not considered polite. But when I lived out there, I asked the waitress, what are your spiritual beliefs?

[23:00] What do you believe? What's your. What's your story? And everybody was looking at me like I was crazy. But I wanted to know who I was talking to. I cared.

[23:10] And it led to multiple times me sharing the gospel. One time I was with a massage therapist there. It was a lovely spa. It was actually in Eugene, Oregon. It was a lovely spa.

[23:23] And the lady and I began talking, and she said, well, she was expecting to be, I think, antagonistic to me because I was a Southerner and a Christian and a conservative.

[23:36] So I probably didn't agree with her politically, but it didn't matter because we were talking about something and she said, well, what do you think about this? And I said, well, I think the problem is not so much what everybody thinks is the problem.

[23:48] I think lust is the problem. I think lust is a problem in the world today. And men abandon women, and women abandon men and vice versa. It really doesn't matter who's involved.

[24:00] They just go off for their own selfish desires. And she stopped and she said, my boyfriend left me this morning for another woman. And I said, well, here's the gospel.

[24:11] I didn't say it like that, but I said, let me tell you what Christ wants to do. And so she. Afterwards, she cried and gave me a hug and said she'd never heard that.

[24:22] And she was so thankful that I sat there. So you're talking about identity, we're talking about sharing and we're talking about connecting people with God who is revealing himself through our stories.

[24:36] And it really made a difference to her.

[24:38] Jan Johnson: Yeah, yeah. And it's listening. It's listening to God's voice saying at the moment, no, tell her, tell her. And us being bold enough to do that, you know, it's just because you don't know what you're going to say at the right time or, you know, if you don't open your mouth.

[24:57] Cathy Garland: Absolutely.

[24:58] Jan Johnson: Yeah, yeah. It's good. All right. So where can people find you?

[25:03] Cathy Garland: Well, they can get the book on Amazon, of course, but it's a little hard to find because the word Revelationship, Amazon doesn't think it's a word. So I tell people, if you're going to look for the book on Amazon, look for Revelationship, and then look for my name, Kathy Garland, with it.

[25:18] It'll come up every time. And you're looking for one with the butterfly. It's got the butterfly on it, so that'll tell you in the right place. Or you can go to revelationship.net

[25:28] and it has the link straight to it and that sort of thing, but it's revelationship.net or on Amazon.

[25:35] Jan Johnson: Great, great. I'll put links in the show notes for that as well. And then one click away. Just one click away.

[25:42] Is it just available in print or is it also an ebook or.

[25:46] Cathy Garland: It is available for Kindle and the audiobook will come out soon.

[25:51] Jan Johnson: Oh, nice. Very good. And then you're working on your second book, so that's going to be out here before too long.

[25:58] Cathy Garland: Yes, it is.

[25:59] Jan Johnson: Right. And I'm sure that'll be on your website as well. So if people wanted to reach that, they could do that.

[26:04] Cathy Garland: Yes, I can.

[26:05] Jan Johnson: Because in six months, somebody might just have listened to this episode.

[26:10] Cathy Garland: That's true. Yes, you're right. And there's also my blog on there. I've been writing a blog, kind of like you, you know, just talking about the things that women who inspire us, things in the Bible, small bits of theology that you can kind of consume before the little hands come under the door.

[26:26] It's, you know, short blogs, and I've been writing it for about 10 years. You can also find that on the blog, on the website.

[26:34] Jan Johnson: Okay. Wonderful. All right. Well, Kathy, such a delight to have you here. And I'm sure that it's going to be a great listen when we get this out there to the world.

[26:44] And. Yeah, thanks so much.

[26:47] Cathy Garland: Thank you for having me. It was fun.