Jennifer James: From Abuse, Drugs and Death to God's Miraculous Grace

"I didn't really understand what it meant to walk with God because i didn't have that example for me at home."
 
Have you been abandoned? Lived a life of abuse? Drugs? Depression? Promiscuity?

 You’re not alone. 

 Did you know that people of the Bible lived these experiences as well?

Joseph was abandoned.
 Tamar was raped.
 David was depressed.
 Mary Magdalene was a prostitute.

 Jennifer James had a father who was addicted to cocaine. Her parents divorced when she was eight, leaving her with a father-hole in her heart. 

 Trying to fill that hole, she sought after what she thought was the love of men. 

The only role model she had was her mother who had a revolving door of men. 

Abuse? Promiscuity, Drugs. Depression.

This was Jennifer’s life….But God

 Hers is a powerful testimony to the amazing redemption and miracles of God.

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Transcript

[00:02] Jan: Welcome to just talking about Jesus. I'm Jan Johnson, a seasoned believer who loves relationships and, you know, just talking about Jesus. Welcome, listeners, to episode ten. In our last episode, we heard from Sean and Nancy Paul, who are missionaries in Guatemala. So far, I'm wondering what has been your favorite episode? I'd love to hear from you. Have you been abandoned? Lived a life of abuse, drugs, depression, promiscuity? You're not alone. Did you know that people of the Bible lived these experiences as well? Joseph was abandoned. Tamar was raped. David was depressed. Mary Magdalene was a prostitute. Jennifer James had a father who was addicted to cocaine. Her parents divorced when she was eight, leaving her with a father whole in her heart trying to fill that hole. She sought after what she thought was the love of men. The only role model she had was her mother, who had a revolving door of men. Abuse, promiscuity, drugs and depression. This was Jennifer's life. But God. Here's a powerful testimony to the amazing redemption and miracles of God. Let's lean into her story. Jennifer Jane, welcome to just talking about Jesus. Glad to have you here.

[01:40] Jennifer: Thank you for having me.

[01:42] Jan: Tell me about yourself.

[01:44] Jennifer: Well, I was raised in alone where we believed in Jesus. I went to christian school all the way from kindergarten up until 10th grade. We went to church, but not very consistently. My father was a cocaine addict and wasn't very. Wasn't really home. I remember him gone more than being home, missing birthdays, Christmas, all holidays. I don't really remember him being there. So my mom, she was pretty good about taking us to church every now and then. I went to youth groups and stuff like that. So I had the truth of God in my life, but my parents weren't really walking it out, so I'd never really had the practical know how of what it means to walk with the Lord. I just knew it up here in my intellectual, you know, space. So growing up as a kid, I was having this deep want and desire of a love of a man because he wasn't there, my father wasn't there. I didn't know that as a kid, but that's just what I realized was this huge gaping hole that affected pretty much my whole journey in life. So my parents divorced when I was eight, my sister was six. We're 18 months apart, and we were very close. My mom used to dress us the same, put our hair the same, so everyone thought we were twins. We both took it pretty hard, and my mom, pretty much after that, had revolving door of boyfriends in and out. She met one man who. She had two more children with my brother and sister. And we're all really close knit family, so we grew up together. They didn't really work out, so more boyfriends after that. When my sister and I hit, you know, our puberty age of twelve to 13, we were very childlike up until that point. Very, very sheltered. My mom kept us in a very tight little bubble, made sure that the world didn't hurt us at all, which was really nice. I had a really great childhood, very innocent and sweet. But when I turned 13, I thought I was grown and the world hit me like a brick wall, and I dressed like I was grown. And we lived in LA. I grew up in Los Angeles, deep in the heart of San Fernando Valley, and lots of gangster like gang member activity. I was the only white girl on my street. All the rest were Mexicans. And I grew up in that culture, and I loved it. Played soccer for six years, you know, all that stuff. And it was great. But the gang member activity kind of hit me real fast when I turned 13 because I started dressing like I was a woman, but I wasn't. I was still a very young girl, and my sister was as well. And my mom was too naive, bless her heart, because she didn't realize what we were kind of stepping into. And my father wasn't there. And when he was around us, he really didn't give us any guidance or direction. So we were kind of left to our own vices and taken advantage of it. At a pretty young age, her and I started to sneak out and meet up with older men in their twenties. And, you know, we thought they were loving us, but they weren't. They were just taking advantage of us. So that kind of behavior continued for a couple years. And my mom, she let some man move into the house that we had met at the mall, and because she felt bad for him. And this man was sleeping with my sister and I both in the house, and my mom didn't know about it. Then when she found out, she pressed charges and this man went to jail for statutory rape. And that really was a catalyst of mental trauma for my sister and I. And the kind of promiscuous activity continued. And I got pregnant at 16. I mean, 17, sorry, right after I turned 17, so pretty close to 16, but 17. And so at this time, I was still, you know, in that christian world, like going to christian school. I had christian friends, you know, spending night at christian families houses who had those, the kind of perfect mom and dad dinner at the table, all the stuff that I always wanted going to youth group, be through camp, you know, singing all those worship songs, having religion class in school, you know, just. But I was living, like, this separate life in LA because I went to school, a town that was like a half hour away, that was kind of more for, like, rich people at a rich christian school. So I never really related to my friends, but I lived in that world half the time.

[06:29] Jan: Yeah.

[06:30] Jennifer: So I was still kind of experiencing, like, God in that way. But I just didn't really understand what it meant to just walk with him because I definitely didn't have that example for me at home. And I had asked Lord in my heart at a child like faith of seven, because, you know, they do those altar calls at school, during chapel. And I had asked him in my heart at seven. Then I asked him in my heart again at 15. But at 15, it was more of, like, God, fix my problems. I don't want you as my lord. I just want you to fix my problems, you know, being honest and.

[07:04] Jan: Right.

[07:04] Jennifer: I. So that was. And then at 17, when I got pregnant, again, I asked him into my life, and again, I think it was more of a lord. I got myself into a big, big change. Saved me, helped me, but I didn't really. I don't think I really, really understood what I was asking. So at 17, I decided to have my baby. And I grew up real quick, and I was kind of dabbling and drinking and smoking marijuana and stuff from the age of, you know, 13 to 16. When I got pregnant, I quit cold turkey, everything. I just wanted to be a good mom. My maternal instincts kicked in at high gear right away. So I grew up and then had my baby. My first, my daughter, my only daughter. I have five boys and one girl, and God knew I needed her first.

[07:55] Jan: She helped me with.

[07:57] Jennifer: Yeah, so. And then I got pregnant again when she was four months old. So I have my second. I had him when she was 13 months old. So it's kind of like having twins. Yeah, they're technically like irish twins, but that was. Yeah, but that was fun. They were a lot of fun. And I kept sober. But after my second child, I had moved from LA to the desert with my husband because I got married at 17, after I found out I was pregnant, dropped out of 10th grade, got married, started playing house. But my husband wasn't ready to grow up. He was 17. Yeah, I just kind of grew up out of that maternal instinct and just made the choice to do that. So I was home alone a lot, didn't have any friends or family? We moved up north to the Mojave desert, lived there. And so I had my two babies at home alone most of the time. He was kind of out partying when he was up and working, but didn't. Wasn't really ready to be a father or a husband, which I don't blame him. We were 17.

[08:58] Jan: Yeah.

[08:59] Jennifer: So after I had my second, I didn't understand or even know what postpartum depression was. I had kind of experienced depression in my teen years after living that life of promiscuity and just not having a father and a mom that worked all the time and just, you know, having the lack of love, I guess, that I needed. But when I turned 18 and had my second, I could feel the difference. I. I definitely felt something different. And I was very depressed. Just having a lot of really strange, bad thoughts. It scared me. I didn't know what to do. It continued to get worse, but I wanted to be a good mom, and my babies were my everything. So I sought help from. And we were going to a baptist church at the time, but I've kind of always had tattoos and piercings. So in the baptist church we were attending, I wasn't really accepted because I was just a young mom, and I don't think people related to me. And I kind of got dirty looks from some people. But I didn't reach out to the church. I reached out to what the world has to offer through counseling and therapy. And they right away slapped me on antidepressants, anti anxiety, not really understanding what I was going through. I just knew my brain and my everything just wasn't feeling right. And I was just scared.

[10:18] Jan: Yeah.

[10:20] Jennifer: So at 18, just going through that postpartum depression, having my two babies alone in a town I wasn't really familiar with, my husband wasn't ready to grow up. So I was kind of just in this deep, dark hole, and I started experiencing just this really dark feeling. Like I always felt like I was being watched, like someone was watching me. And. I don't know, I think I really always felt like the enemy was just messing with my head. That's how I always felt. So when I went to therapy and I would tell them this, they can't really. They're not really supposed to dive into the spiritual sense of things. They're supposed to be more on the psychological aspect of it. But I always felt it was a spiritual attack.

[11:04] Jan: Yeah.

[11:05] Jennifer: So I was always confused about that, and never. They never, never really resonated with that. When I was trying to tell them. But my husband at the time, with my first two, he brought home marijuana and said, hey, you want to smoke this? Because he was out partying and I was at home sober, so he brought it home thinking it would help me. So that kind of ended my sober streak, and I got back into smoking and then the drinking and would do that at night when the babies would go to bed. And then he started inviting friends over, so we kind of started just partying again. And I was figuring they were doing the trial and error of medication to see which would work best for me. So I was kind of on and off different medications and experiencing all the different side effects from those and going through some weird stuff and drinking and smoking and so self medicating and letting the doctors medicate me. Nothing was really helping. I was actually just getting worse.

[12:01] Jan: Yeah.

[12:02] Jennifer: So through all that, was inviting all this part, started talking to one of his friends, and we began a relationship. And my, my marriage to my first husband, we were so young, we were just babies ourselves, and we just kind of grew apart. There was not really much there. We, we divorced, and I married this friend of ours, who, by the way, been together almost 22 years in October. But it was just the way it happened. So we related on a lot of issues through depression and lots of, like, bad thoughts and dealing with self harm, eating disorders, all that stuff. We related in our depression, in our, in our darkness. So that was kind of how we gravitated towards each other. So that kind of threw us into a whirlwind of even more addiction because we were kind of in our sorrows and in our darkness together, we kind of just, he was already into, you know, drugs and alcohol as well. So we just kind of jumped in full force together in that, and it kind of just got worse. And we broke up for a while. Then we got back together. And when we got back together, I got pregnant with our first son, my third child, once again, I got sober again, quit everything. Yeah. I was very motivated once. When I know I have a, another human inside of me, I don't want to do anything, you know, I want to make sure that I'm the best, best I can be for them. So I would always get sober as soon as I found out I was pregnant.

[13:38] Jan: Yeah.

[13:39] Jennifer: And after I had him, I hit my son, Ashton. My postpartum depression got worse again. It came up and it just kind of came on heavier. Having three kids. I was 23 at the time. Not the greatest relationship because of the foundation that we had laid it on. Depression, darkness just all kinds of addictions. We didn't really have a really good, firm foundation of a relationship, but we got married two months after our son was born. So we decided just to get married. You know, we were together. We had a son. We were going to the same baptist church, and our pastor came to the room. When we had our son into the hospital, he sat down and he said, so when are you guys going to get married? So we just decided, well, so, yeah, two months later, we got married. It was a. There were some sweet people at that church, and they loved on us, even though I think they knew we weren't walking with the Lord. We were both, you know, tattoos and piercings and just kind of had that look about us. But we still came to church, get to church every now and then. So I feel like God always kind of had me in a place where he was close, and I knew he was close. I just. I just didn't. I only knew him in my, you know, intellectually right. It hadn't hit my heart yet. So we got married, and after I was done nursing, because I would stay sober until I was nursing, get right back into the smoking weed and drinking really heavily every night, and just. Just back in that self medication kind of self sabotage. The darkness kind of seemed heavier. I would see things. Shadows or my house out my window, just things looking at me. I always felt like the enemy was really messing with me. And I would tell that to myself. My counselors, I would always say, you know, Satan's messing with me. And they would just kind of look at me like, what does that mean? Yeah. And they, you know, jot down on their notepad, whatever, they jot down. But they could never give me any kind of feedback to that.

[15:44] Jan: They didn't have any understanding of that, you know? Right, right. That's how I had a possibility of a reality.

[15:51] Jennifer: Mm hmm. So, yeah, I would always just say, yeah, I feel like I'm in a deep, dark hole and Satan's laughing at me. And they just didn't really have much to tell me. They just kept upping my medication levels, so they found one that worked for me. I was on Prozac, and every time I go and I see me declining and getting worse, they would just keep upping my level of milligrams. And I remember one time I was talking to the psychiatrist, because after talking to the therapist they sent me, he would tell me that he's just going to up my levels of medication. And I remember, okay, this is the highest amount we can give you after this, I can't give you any higher. He said, you know, this. This should help. And I remember thinking myself, well, gosh, if this doesn't help and this is the most they can give me and I don't get better, what else do I do, right? And I went to my car and I just bawled my eyes out because I felt like there's just no hope. I mean, I just felt like there was nothing that was going to help me. And I felt hopeless, and I was. I just had so much despair, and I just felt like I was in that darkness and I was never going to get out. And I got pregnant again. I was not ready for number four baby. I was very, very depressed about being pregnant again. Called my mom, crying, crying so much, am I pregnant again? And I just. I was 26, and I said, I don't want another baby. And she said. She said, God gives every baby to you for a reason. This is a miracle baby. Be thankful for him or for this baby. So my mom helped. My mom helped, you know, turn my heart around about that, and I just, you know, realized she's right. Every baby that God gives us is. This is for a specific reason, and he knows what he's doing. And so, you know, I. My mom would always give me this kind of godly advice, even though she wasn't walking with the Lord at the time, just still boyfriends revolving in and out. And she would smoke with me sometimes, you know, so we had, like, this christian belief in our family, but there wasn't, like a Christian, a real christian walk. So I guess I never saw that practically being walked out. So I just didn't even know what that meant. But I took her godly advice when she gave it to me, and it helped at times. So again, I got sober, finding out I was pregnant, you know, like I always did. I just get sober, drop everything. My husband kind of continued a little bit here and there and just. But that was fine. I didn't mind. And so when we had our fourth, or my husband, my husband and I, second, but my fourth, he was a week late. He was a big boy. He was eleven pounds 2oz. And I'm a small woman. I'm five foot. My torso is very short, so my babies pop right out. Like, pop out. My. Don't really have much room for them to grow up, you know, this way. But when we went to go have him, he got stuck during being pushed. I was pushing, and he got stuck for about 20 minutes. And as the doctor was panicking and the nurse suggested an emergency c section. The doctor cut his umbilical cord while he was still in me, and he went without oxygen for 2030 minutes, and they had to resuscitate him. When he finally came out, it was a terrible traumatic birth, and he was brain dead. He only lasted nine days. And we went to. We lived in a tiny little desert town in Mojave. Desert, the desert. The doctor that delivered me was the only doctor that took medi Cal, and he was old and grumpy, and I think he was just burnt out and didn't. He couldn't handle what had happened, and so he tried to break his clavicles. Poor baby came out all bruised up, and so we were live flighted to a teaching hospital about 3 hours away so that they could run every test possible to see if there's anything at all they could do to save him. And there wasn't. There was nothing they could do. So that was a huge wake up call for my husband and I. My husband, mind you, throughout our relationship. We were together for about three, four years. Up until this point, he had dabbled in Satanism, Buddhism, didn't want to raise our kids. Knowing Jesus was just doing it to keep me happy. We'd fight about God, and he hated God. He was raised by men who profess to be christians and beat him profusely as a little child, so he had this hatred towards God. But when we. When we were at the hospital, they were trying to find out if they could save our son, Gavin, he was. I saw him in the bathroom, and he dropped to his knees, and he was praying and begging God to help us and to restore our son and to save our son. And it was like that moment, I couldn't believe I saw my husband on his knees because he hated God. That was the turning point for us, because after we lost our son, of course, the church we were going to, the baptist church, they loved on us. They were there for us. We held a little memorial service for him, and they. They did a meal, train, all. That's great stuff. And. And my husband and I, we slipped into, you know, a darker place. We had everything ready for him. The crib, the stroller, all the clothes. Everything was out and ready. Our three kids were excited to have a little brother, so we had to help our kids through the grieving process. They were three, six, and seven, and it was just heart. Heartbreak for our family. Just terrible. Yes. It was just something we never expected. We weren't ready for. I mean, I don't think anybody ever is, but we sued the hospital and we. When we got a certain amount of money, we settled for a certain amount that was enough for us to hightail it out of that Mojave desert, little rinky **** town that we never wanted to be a part of again. So we moved to Oregon and we bought a house in Astoria. That's why we have so many common friends, because I lived. We lived in Astoria, in Warrenton for twelve years. And once we got there, we wanted a new start. A new fresh start. We didn't really know anybody. His aunt and uncle lives there. That's why we moved there. And we thought it was beautiful and it was a great little town. And we started going to First Baptist church in Astoria. And they were loving on us and we. But we were still drinking. We got right back into drinking and smoking weed because we were depressed. You know, we were ultra depressed, even more so now, just trying to hold it together for our three kids. Both of us struggled with suicidal thoughts and self harm. And so we're still kind of in that boat of just riding that deep, dark depression together. And we were just kind of in it harder because we lost our son. And I got scared because my postpartum depression came back with a ferocity that I had never felt before. And I was scared because the bridge is there in Astoria. They don't have bridges in LA. They don't have bridges in Mojave Desert. But I was struggling with wanting to veer my car off and off into the water. I was just having these strong thoughts in my head to kill myself so much that it was scaring me because I had children. And so I had this really just intense battle going on in my mind. And I was so scared. I didn't see a doctor there because we moved there. I said, oh, this is a fresh start. I'm just going to start fresh. I don't need to see any therapist. I don't want to start any medication anymore. But I was still self medicating. And I remember thinking, okay, I got to do something. Either I got to start back up with a counselor, therapist, get right back on medication, or something else. I knew that didn't work because I had been down that road for ten years and nothing worked. The amount of cocktails and medications they'd put me on, none of them worked. But then we started going to a different church because First Baptist just, it was really small and we had our three kids and they were like the only kids there. So we kind of wanted to reach out to another church with it. The kids there were the more kids for our children to play with. And so we wound up going to coastline christian fellowship. And that church just kind of lit our hearts on fire because we originally started going there for their free meal on Wednesday. We'd actually just go and eat and leave. They were so sweet. They loved on us so much. I said, hey, why don't you stay for the service? And we'd be like, no, we already ate. We're just going to go. We did that for, like, two or three weeks. And they. They let us. They just let us come eat their food, leave. And then we finally decided, you know, sure, we'll stay. Because they kept saying, hey, come on in. We have a service going on. And it was Steven Smiley. I don't know if you know any of the people there, but they were just super sweet. And we finally decided to just listen to one of the services. And instantly, God just started working really, really strong in our hearts. And I had received prayer from someone there to break addictions. I knew I needed to just stop smoking weed and drinking because it just was something I wanted to stop. But I had been doing since I was 14, on and off all. It was the only way I knew how to cope, but I wanted it gone. So I asked. They had said, hey, if anyone needs any prayer for addiction or anything at all, an addiction, it hit me. So I said, I went up there and I got prayer, and I was bawling like a baby, like snot, slobbering tears, you know, and I didn't even know this person praying for me. I felt the power of God just so strong. And my husband was also, you know, God was working on him as well. And we used to get a bottle of Jagermeister every single night. And that was what we drank every night and smoked weed. We just. That was our nightly routine. But we had done that one night after we were, you know, going to church, and we had got our usual bottle of liquor, and we sat there and contemplated drinking it for an hour. I never did that. We just. Something didn't feel right.

[25:50] Jan: That might have been the Holy Spirit.

[25:52] Jennifer: Yes, definitely. Because it was not something that we were used to doing. We were actually kind of dumbfounded as to why we were contemplating drinking it. I mean, we couldn't wait. As soon as kids went to bed, that was just our thing. We'd just go get drunk and high, and that was our thing. And it took us an hour, and we decided, well, we spent the money on it. Let's not waste it. Let's just drink it. So ridiculous. But we drank it, and I don't really think we even got any feeling from that bottle. And we realized, okay, we just need to stop. I think God's making it pretty loud and clear that this isn't for us. We just need to let go of it. So one night, my husband and I, we got in a huge argument, like, just really bad. And he. He left on his motorcycle. It was. I don't even know what time it was. I mean, we were. We had just got done drinking, and so when he left, I was super upset because I was worried that he'd, you know, get in an accident or something. And he said. He went and he. He had an encounter with God. He. He fell on his knees, and he was crying out to the Lord, saying, you know, we need to stop doing this. We're not honoring our son that just passed away. We're not honoring our children we have now. You know, he said, we're not honoring you. He knew that we weren't living right. And when he came back, you know, we had this huge talk. So we were basically on the same place of knowing that we needed to change, but we were kind of going through it differently. But we knew we were going through it together somehow. So that night, after a huge argument and my husband having an encounter with the lord personally, we had decided to make that decision together, which was not easy, because we had been eight years in. No, we knew each other on this. On the foundation of drinking and being high. That was how we knew how to communicate. That was how we knew how to laugh together, how we. We knew how to be with each other was just high and drunk and completely just stopped cold turkey. We didn't. We didn't wean ourselves or anything. We just were done. And I was taking birth control pills at the time, and I had been letting the Lord know on my heart that I wanted another baby. He knew I wanted another one. And so I was taking the birth control pills, and I said, you know what? I told the Lord one day, I said, I'm just going to throw these away, and you just bless us whenever you want to give us another one, because we're ready. Because my husband and I had just been talking about it, and we knew we wanted another one. So I threw those birth control pills in the trash, and we got pregnant again. And we were very excited this time because we had been trying and we were anticipating. This was the first time that I, you know, we had actually, like, tried to get pregnant. And I always tell my kids, you know, God knew. He specifically picked out each and every one of you. It's just, you know, we only had, like, tried with, with the last ones because the other ones were more of a surprise. But God picked you up. God knew, you know, what he was doing when he picked you out. So we got pregnant. We were super excited and very happy and, you know, sober and just trying to learn and saved. We had both personally accepted Jesus into our heart. I remember I was talking to my mom because she lived in Florida and she had a really strong church family there. And this was when we were just starting to get into our church family, so we didn't know them that great yet. And she said, well, Jen, if you want help, you can fly out to Florida and you can talk to my really good friend here who specializes in helping people with, you know, depression and, and all those things. And I was contemplating flying out to Florida just to kind of receive that help because I was, this was, you know, right before we had made that decision to just get sober cold turkey. And I remember I was standing on my porch one day and I was looking out at the beautiful forest that Oregon has to offer. And I remember God, not audibly, but spoke to my heart, you don't have to go to Florida for me to heal you. I can heal you right here. And I remember thinking to myself, okay, Lord, thank you, because I don't have to fly to Florida. That was, you know, expensive plane ticket. And that was, I think, something that was so special that he spoke to my heart because that was what gave me the assurance, the courage and the assurance, yeah. To step out into that faith of knowing, okay, he's here with me. He wants to help me. And so we owned a coffee shop, my husband and I. And I was sitting in our coffee shop one night, and I was, this is when I was still contemplating, you know, going back on medication. What do I do? My depression, my thoughts were just really heavy. And I remember telling the Lord, okay, lord, I'm done. I'm done taking what the Lord, what the, what the world has to offer. I'm done doing what the world has to offer. Tell me what you got. And I think he said, all right. He said, ok, I'm going to show you what I got. So I remember having that personal, that personal encounter with the Lord. And I think that was when the pivot happened of me turning from the world to him. And I know he was just waiting because he just flooded his love on me at that point. Like, from then on, it was just full, full. Just grace and love and mercy and just. My depression was gone. My addictions were gone. I didn't feel like I needed alcohol anymore. I didn't want marijuana anymore. I felt like a new person, literally. Like, my thoughts were gone, the suicidal thoughts were gone. I felt lighter. I just had joy that I had never experienced before. I didn't feel like I was in a deep, dark hole anymore. I felt like a new person. I had never experienced that before. I was just blown away because I. My whole life, I had known God up here. I knew all the Bible stories. I knew what Jesus had done on the cross. I knew the Bible. You know what I mean? I knew that. All that stuff. But it had never hit me in my heart ever. And so just knowing that difference and feeling that difference was just a game changer for me. And the depression leaving was a huge, huge, life altering, heart relieving feeling that I had never felt before. And it just felt amazing. And that was. This was all around the same time that we found out we were pregnant. So it was like God did, like, so much really quickly. We got rid of my husband's buddhist little statues. We, like, right away got, like, the Holy Spirit's light in our eyes. We started looking around our house like, okay, we need to get rid of this. We need to get rid of that. I had dabbled in, like, stealing things in the past. So I looked at my stuff I had stolen. I was like, I need to get rid of those things. They're not mine. They don't belong to me. So we just started purging our house with all these things that weren't of the Lord that we knew in our heart weren't of him. Before, it didn't even faze us, but now we've realized we need to get rid of some stuff, you know? And it was amazing because God just started doing all this for work real quick, and it was great, but my husband and I were still just trying to learn how to be together because we really didn't know each other.

[32:57] Jan: Yeah, that was a whole new way of navigating.

[33:00] Jennifer: Yes, definitely. So that was a difficult one. But because of all the really fast blessings and healings and everything, the first year was amazing. And so when we found out we were pregnant, I went to my first appointment, and I had expressed to my doctor what we had experienced losing our son three years prior. So three years had gone by, and I was just bawling my eyes out to her, just telling her my story, and she was very, very sweet. Very, very sweet lady. And so we went to go do the ultrasound, and as soon as she put the ultrasound on my stomach, we saw two little eggs in there. We had twins. I was shocked. I couldn't believe it.

[33:43] Jan: Isn't that just with God to just.

[33:45] Jennifer: Yes, yes. So I. I knew instantly God was like, you had lost one. I'm going to give you double. And I was. I literally just lost it. I was. But tears of joy this time I just got done, you know, tears of sadness and grief, and it changed straight over to tears of joy. And I, my husband wasn't able to be at the appointment, so I called him right away and told him, and he started crying. And we were just so, so excited.

[34:15] Jan: Wow.

[34:16] Jennifer: And it just healed our whole family because we got home, we told our kids, and they literally were just jumping up and down and just, like, laughing and clapping their hands. They were so happy. Our family was just so happy because we had gone through three years of grieving, and they had seen their parents go through grieving and depression. They just, they knew. It was just so hard on our family. So instantly, like, within a month or two, I don't know where it came from, obviously, the Lord, but I was not a reader before I got saved. I instantly had just this hunger for God's word. Like, I could not stop reading it. And I. So I started just reading it, the New Testament. And then I had met a friend at church. Well, she's a sweet, seasoned saint, and she had told me, you got to read the Old Testament, too. And I said, I don't know. I know some of the stories. She said, no, it's. It's God's heart, just like the New Testament is. They go together. Great. So I started reading the Old Testament, and I was talking to a friend of mine, my mom's, and he was telling me about King Josiah, and he was telling me how we kind of reminded him of King Josiah because of just the drastic change. Once Josiah had found God's law and realized that they weren't living right, and he just changed his whole kingdom and, you know, purged all the evil and all that. And so he said, you guys remind me of Josiah and how God's working in your life. So I knew right away that's going to be the name of one of our babies. We didn't even know if we were having boys or girls yet, but I knew Josiah is one of the names we're naming our babies. So we found out we were having boys, and so we realized we had to pick another name. So we started praying and just searching what name would fit, and we came up with Jeremiah. Both of those names, actually, once we realized those were the names we wanted to name our boys and that the Lord had given us, we looked up the meanings. And Josiah means God heals, and Jeremiah means God lifts up. And instantly it just hit my heart because God had healed us. And I always felt like I was in that deep, dark hole I couldn't get out of. And that saint was laughing at me. And I remember vividly thinking God had, like, put his hand down in that hole and pulled me out. So Jeremiah means God lifts up. Those names just meant so much to me. And I knew God had given us our boys for a purpose, for a reason, all of our children. But, you know, we just, it was such a healing process for our family. And they were big babies. They were twins. They were seven, seven four and 715. I had 15.3 pounds of babies.

[36:55] Jan: My gosh, I had a c section.

[36:58] Jennifer: Because, you know, the doctor said, let's just do c section. That way there's no complications or worries. And, and they're twelve now, so they're my. They're my babies. God just drastically changed our whole family, our kids. Before we were saved, we used to listen to unsavory music and stuff that our kids probably shouldn't have been listening to. And our kids, you know, we instantly just started changing and switching over to, like, christian music and clean music. And we started dressing differently. So our kids saw that, that change in their parents. And it happened pretty quickly because we weren't depressed anymore and we were going to church all the time.

[37:39] Jan: And church was different for you, going with this, kind of hearing it better now? Everything was going right to your heart.

[37:50] Jennifer: Yes, definitely. And I started just having all these light bulb moments because, like I said, I knew God in my mind. But once your mind and your heart are aligned and it just, like, all these things that I already known just kind of had all these, the meanings all came alive to me. You know, all the Bibles, all the Bible truths and all the things in the Bible that I had heard my whole life, but hearing them now with my heart and knowing Jesus personally, they just hit me so, so differently. And just the healing just was so powerful in my heart because I, all that time I had been wanting the love of a father because my father wasn't there and sought it from older men. I instantly knew God. You're my father. You're what I've been craving this whole time, you're the only one that can give me that love that I've been wanting and needing. You're the, you know, you're. You're my answer. I've had been searching in all the wrong places.

[38:43] Jan: And how was that your husband? You know, God drew him at the same time so that you could journey together?

[38:51] Jennifer: Yes, definitely. It hasn't been, you know, an easy journey, but it's definitely been full blessings and restoration and healing. You know, God had to do some huge changes in our marriage as well so that we can kind of start from scratch and learn how to be with each other, but as a marriage, as a christian couple, and just pretty much learn how to be with each other, like, as people, you know, talk to each other, communicate, it was so. But God is so good, and he's been, he's. He's been so good to us. And, you know, I still have the stain of the world on me, but I started choosing tattoos that represented God more. So, you know, I have the Lord's prayer on my arm, and, you know, we just. I just tried to choose tattoos that I feel like represent the Lord more.

[39:40] Jan: But, yeah, so you have some favorite scriptures that just, you cling to.

[39:50] Jennifer: Romans 1212 has always kind of just been my. My core verse that I've always turned to. I love it because it's so simple, you know, but so powerful. And it's just something I've always turned to when I just need that. That truth, you know, be joyful and hope patient and affliction patient in affliction and faithful in prayer. And I just love those, those truths, but they're so powerful. And Jeremiah 20 911, you know, that he has good plans for us, plans for us to prosper and to harm us and just, yeah, I definitely appreciate God's word so much, and it's really been an anchor for me because living in this world can be very difficult and, you know, there's still trials and tribulations and culties, and it's not easy.

[40:48] Jan: Have you found a good faith community where you're living now?

[40:52] Jennifer: Yes. So we had moved from Oregon three years ago, almost three years ago. We now live in North Florida. We're in the panhandle. We're about 30 minutes away from the southern border of Alabama. And one of the things that we actually were looking for when we made the decision to move to Florida is defined a Calvary church. Because since we had been going to the Calvary church in Astoria, we decided we love Calvary church. We love the way they teach systematically through the whole bible, through the whole council of God's word. We wanted to stick to that, so we found a Calvary church in Alabama. We have to drive an hour, but it's worth it. Yeah, they're not, they're not as plentiful here like they are on the west coast. There are a few in Florida, but they're very far away. So Alabama. And we've been going there since when we moved here. We found we started going about a month after we moved here. So we've been going there for almost three years. And we love our church family. And they love you? Oh, yeah, they love us, too. And our kids love it. You know, the youth group there is great. And it's still a baby church. They're only like five years in, so it's kind of small, but it's. It's great. The people there are amazing.

[41:58] Jan: So, Jennifer, what would you tell a listener who might have been in your past? What would you tell them?

[42:07] Jennifer: Well, what I would say, and this is what I try to tell anyone that I ever talk to, is, you know, the world has a lot to offer, but there is nothing in this world that can fill your soul and heal your heart like the Lord can. Like God. God can only. Is the only one that can heal your heart and change your heart and restore your heart. And I feel like everything that the world has to offer is just temporary. You know, we can experience some temporary joys in this world, and I truly believe that God is the only one that can. It can make us whole, that can give us meaning in life, and that can help us be who we were created to be.

[42:54] Jan: Good word, huh? You had a long journey to get there, but how wonderful. Look at, you've got a long journey ahead of you and look at what a great role model you can be for your kids. Both of you can be for your kids. Just even having a solid marriage together, for them to see that and have both of you in their lives.

[43:15] Jennifer: Yes, definitely. Yes. My children are my mission field, so they're my, they're the ones I pour into the most.

[43:21] Jan: Yeah.

[43:22] Jennifer: And either they're my everything. And my oldest have had their moments where they walked away for a bit, but they've come back and definitely having my anchor in Jesus, I've been able to share with them and help them through their struggles. So that's been definitely been a blessing.

[43:37] Jan: And, well, thank you, because this has just been amazing. This has been a real blessing. Well, Brenda, that was a lot to take in right it was so much brokenness in there, and you just see how things kind of compounded for her, you know, starting with her dad being a cocaine addict and then a divorce. I mean, just a divorce anytime is rough on kids.

[44:18] Brenda: Absolutely.

[44:19] Jan: And then the revolving door where mom having guys in and out and then ended up getting raped, it's just like.

[44:28] Brenda: It'S a recipe for disaster and brokenness.

[44:31] Jan: So much, so much there. But you know that when she was going to church too, you know, I mean, so there was that. So she did at least have some sense of God.

[44:42] Brenda: Absolutely.

[44:42] Jan: You know, but not being able to really grasp on to who he was.

[44:48] Brenda: Yes. She couldn't fully see the depth of who he was.

[44:52] Jan: And she said something about having a deep want and desire to have the love of a man. And that so often happens when there's that abandonment of a dad.

[45:04] Brenda: Absolutely. I agree with that. And that I can say that that resonates with me because you, if you don't have that, you're looking for it. You're looking for that fulfillment from man, from the world, because your life is imbalanced. It's not the way God created it to be. And you just want to be seen and loved and accepted.

[45:26] Jan: Yeah. And, you know, that has to interfere with who daddy God is.

[45:31] Brenda: Oh, definitely.

[45:32] Jan: You know how you see God? Because if he's going to be the father figure and yours wasn't all that great.

[45:38] Brenda: Yeah. How do you see that father? God is good and loving and is not how so many earthly fathers are. How do you see that, especially a young person, if you don't see it in anybody else or anybody else's families, you just think what you're living is normal.

[45:57] Jan: Yeah. Yeah.

[45:59] Brenda: And it's empty.

[46:00] Jan: Yeah. And she did say something about when she was going to a christian school or being with some other christian families and seeing how wanting what they had, but there still was not that connection of, oh, I could have that possibly. Right, right.

[46:16] Brenda: I think there is that you see it in others. I remember seeing what you think are normal families, but I don't think that it really clicks that you can be different, that you can write a different story, that God can carry you on a different path. You don't have to keep repeating the same experiences that you have had.

[46:39] Jan: Well, you know, and then, of course, there's the aspect of when you're a kid, what are you gonna do, right. You're powerless, you know, in some ways, you know, unless you've got somebody from school or from a church, it really makes a connection with you. Right, right.

[46:55] Brenda: Where's the advocate? You need one.

[46:56] Jan: You need an advocate, which ultimately we have in Jesus. Right, right. That's the very thing that we need.

[47:04] Brenda: Yep.

[47:05] Jan: But it's kind of nice to have that personal. On the feet, on the ground.

[47:09] Brenda: Right, right, yep. Exactly.

[47:11] Jan: That's making that happen. What a hard life to reckon and then to be pregnant and you're just a kid and you're still trying. I mean, she chose life. You gotta give her that.

[47:22] Brenda: Absolutely. That's so great that she did choose that. And, you know, I love that. Eventually she got to that point where she realized that, you know, I think it was her mom that said God chose these babies.

[47:36] Jan: Yeah.

[47:36] Brenda: You know, I always tell people God created you on purpose for a purpose.

[47:42] Jan: Yeah.

[47:43] Brenda: And he chose those babies, and she did choose life. It was rough for quite a while.

[47:49] Jan: It was rough. But also, you know, I just give her so much credit for realizing that she had life and that she needed to protect it so that she quit doing drugs and quit doing alcohol and, you know, those destructive behaviors. That's amazing during the pregnancy, which is a hard thing to do.

[48:07] Brenda: Right. And it's not the story that we hear so often.

[48:10] Jan: Right. And that was courageous. She was so courageous to do that.

[48:14] Brenda: I wonder if. I'm sure now she can see that God had his hand on her for sure. He was, you know, working in her life even when she didn't know him on that deep level.

[48:27] Jan: Yeah. You know, and she said several times that she'd accepted the Lord. I think that is a process as well, you know, because when you're seven and you do, you're a different person when you're 14 and 17 and 20 and whatever. I know that he's got something for me, but what is that, really? I know that I'm supposed to. You know, I do want that at some level, she wanted that, you know.

[48:52] Brenda: That was there to recognize that yearning for more.

[48:57] Jan: Yeah. Yeah.

[48:58] Brenda: Her spirit was telling her there's more.

[49:00] Jan: Right, right. Definitely more. And then I think it's such a normal thing to live a dual life, you know, to go to the christian school. But then, meanwhile, I'm still this other person that nobody knows about and to be able to balance out and still be that. I think a lot of us do that.

[49:19] Brenda: Oh, I think so. I think that's more the norm. We can all catch ourselves doing it no matter how mature we are in our faith. You can look at what environment am I in. Am I behaving differently? Because. Oh, I'm in this particular environment where people are more, you know, maybe they're being a little more crude or a little more wild or whatever it is.

[49:41] Jan: Yeah.

[49:42] Brenda: Do I sort of adjust my personality and my behavior to fit the situation? And I think that's easy and common for so many of us. We have to have that awareness to be consistent and to be genuine.

[49:59] Jan: You're going to have the incidence of feeling shame if you know what you're doing on one side and then in that other christian environment, that's supposed to be a certain way. Right. And whatever they tell you. Exactly, you know, there to do. But I'm guessing that she wasn't showing her christian side when she was.

[50:21] Brenda: I'm guessing that probably is true on the other side, the worldly way.

[50:26] Jan: Right.

[50:26] Brenda: You know, especially if you live in a gang sort of occupied area. You know, I don't know if you've been in that area where she was talking about where she lived, but it's true, you know, you want to fit in and the sort of whitewashed christian girl isn't going to fit in in that environment, especially the fact that she was a white girl in a predominantly mexican neighborhood or, you know, situation that already made her stand out.

[50:57] Jan: Right.

[50:57] Brenda: So being a kid who doesn't have a strong support system to be who she's supposed to be, you're going to be like a leaf in the wind.

[51:05] Jan: Yeah.

[51:05] Brenda: Going to bend so that you fit.

[51:08] Jan: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Wherever you are, huh?

[51:12] Brenda: Exactly.

[51:14] Jan: And, you know, there's no surprise that she would have postpartum depression, which would spiral you down. And then even the idea that she knew that there was a force, a negative force, that Satan getting his hands on her, she knew it was more than just depression, just, you know, a normal experience of that or whatever, you know, that it was something way more than that.

[51:42] Brenda: Right.

[51:42] Jan: And look at how many doors that were open for Satan to come in.

[51:46] Brenda: Oh, so many. I think about her counselors that, you know, so many of them had to be thinking, oh, you know, does this girl need to go to the psych ward? She's talking about Satan. They have no idea what spiritual warfare is.

[52:00] Jan: Right.

[52:01] Brenda: But I love that God gave her an awareness of that. You know, she couldn't dig herself out of it, but she knew something bigger was going on.

[52:08] Jan: Yeah.

[52:09] Brenda: I love that she talked about, you know, they lived in the desert, and in my mind, I was thinking being in the desert, literally and figuratively wilderness.

[52:17] Jennifer: Right.

[52:18] Brenda: Yes. And she was hurting. I love how she talked about how she and her husband didn't really know each other, you know, because they. They had all these things, you know, the drugs and the alcohol, and their life was based on something else.

[52:31] Jan: Yeah.

[52:31] Brenda: And, boy, they were in a desert.

[52:34] Jan: And God rescued them and having to relearn all of that. But wasn't it miraculous when she finally grabbed on to God and everything instantly for her just changed, you know, it just. It just seemed like once she could finally really taste who he was and really get through that deep emotional level right where you're crying your eyes out and really got it. Okay, I get this, right, you know, because it takes that getting down to that heart issue, right?

[53:12] Brenda: Oh, it absolutely does.

[53:14] Jan: Because there were so many things that happened to her that just, you know, when you really understand who he is and that he can be that dad you were looking for, the one that really cares about me, regardless of what I've done or who I think I am or, you know, that's the focus right there.

[53:35] Brenda: Regardless of who you are that you recognize, you need a savior. You are incapable of saving yourself, only Christ. And that's where I feel like all the pride goes away. Any self righteousness, defensiveness. You know, we want to be good, and we want to be right all on our own, but we're not. You know, we're. We're filth. We're unworthy. Yeah, and she. She finally got that.

[54:00] Jan: Yeah. Yeah, and, you know, when. When she said that God spoke to her heart, you know, just totally spoke and said, you don't have to go to Florida to be healed. I'm right here. It's like, oh, oh. You know, I mean, that whole revelation, first of all, to recognize that was God speaking to your heart, and then to say, no, you don't need to be dealing with suicidal thoughts anymore. You don't need to do any of that. You know, all of that. That's who I am.

[54:32] Brenda: I love that. It's that light bulb moment, that recognition that I've got this. I've got all the power that you need, and I can save you. Her story is beautiful because not everybody gets completely healed of things like depression. And it would be easy to think, well, my faith must not be strong, but that's not how it is. He heals some people. Other people. There's a reason, and if we could really just sit in that trust that we trust, and there's a reason, and we can trust that whatever suffering we go through, there's growth in it for us.

[55:10] Jan: And everybody's story is different.

[55:12] Brenda: Everybody's.

[55:13] Jan: And that's another beauty. Of God, you know, is to be able to see your hearts, see everybody's hearts for who they are, and he knows what you need and when you need it. Yeah, that's perfect.

[55:26] Brenda: That makes me think of listening to her and thinking about the experiences she had in some of the churches where she was not welcomed or invited in. You know, I've been in those situations, I think all of us have, where it just almost feels like there's an invisible wall that you just can't get past. That makes me think of how all of us just want to be known. We want to be seen on a deeper level. And if we can all sort of live in that posture of remembering that, that all of us don't have value outside of Christ. And to look for that person that is alone or on their own, to say more than hi, to really look them in the eye, whether they look like us or they look completely different, they're just as valuable as we are. And we might find a unique connection with someone that we would never, ever suspect if we didn't speak to them.

[56:21] Jan: Right. Right ways. It's something that the universal church could work on.

[56:27] Brenda: Absolutely.

[56:27] Jan: Or to really be watching, you know, in the morning before you come to church and say, God, who do you want me to encounter, who do you want me to speak to and who do you want me to maybe build a relationship with? You know, maybe if she'd have had that somebody that did that relationship with her way earlier, it could have changed.

[56:48] Brenda: Her life, it could have prevented so much pain. That's the greatest thing, though, we can say, yes, somebody missed the opportunity, and I'm sure God was calling people, step into this girl's life, speak to her on a deeper level. There's more here, really invest. But God can take all of it and turn it into a beautiful story. Yeah, I love that he takes everything we've gone through, everything we go through, and he still writes it into a beautiful story if we let him and we turn to him. And hopefully for someone like her, there are so many stories like this. Hopefully it creates that sort of invitation and awareness to look for those people. Like you said, I love to pray on Sunday morning or show me that person who's alone, who is feeling lonely, who's feeling unseen, you don't know who you're going to affect. One smile, one look in the eye like you matter could change the trajectory of someone's life.

[57:49] Jan: Right.

[57:50] Brenda: And you don't know it, but that's how Jesus shines. We just have to be open to it.

[57:54] Jan: Right.

[57:55] Brenda: Instead of the rush, you know, which is what we do, you know, especially if you're trying to get the kids ready and you're getting them to church and getting in the door and you come in and you're sweating and you're crabby and you've been, you know, cranking.

[58:07] Jan: At each other in the car, and.

[58:10] Brenda: Then you get here and put on the church face. That's not what God is looking for. You know, we really need to take that moment to say, holy spirit, reveal to me who I can invest in, even if it's just a hello and.

[58:26] Jan: Maybe you want to go to coffee or maybe I can watch your kids so you can go shopping or do something or whatever, but something that would build a little bit more of a relationship to open the door to vulnerability. That's beautiful.

[58:42] Brenda: Absolutely.

[58:43] Jan: Right.

[58:43] Brenda: Yep. That's the way we need to be living.

[58:45] Jan: I mean, obviously she had people from churches that were helping her out. You know, we're giving her baby things and doing the kind of things which are all really good, wonderful things.

[58:56] Brenda: Right.

[58:56] Jan: And I don't negate any of that, you know, but there's always that more.

[59:01] Brenda: Yeah. That deeper.

[59:02] Jan: How can we be more? Yeah, yeah.

[59:06] Brenda: It just takes one person.

[59:07] Jan: Yeah. Yeah. So I feel a little like. Yeah, that's God talking to me, too. How can I be more? It's like a little fire, right? Yeah. How can I be more to somebody else and maybe help disciple them?

[59:23] Brenda: Absolutely. That's. That's where God wants us to be.

[59:26] Jan: And I just. Isn't it so like God to give her twins?

[59:30] Brenda: Oh, when I heard that, I was thinking of the double portion and I was thinking about Elisha knew that Elijah was going to be taken up and what was his last request? He wanted a double portion.

[59:44] Jan: Yeah.

[59:45] Brenda: And that's so neat. They had lost, they suffered, they grieved, and it seemed like an unnecessary loss.

[59:53] Jan: Yeah.

[59:54] Brenda: And then God gave him that double portion.

[59:56] Jan: Yeah.

[59:57] Brenda: What a. Just a beautiful redemption.

[59:59] Jan: And into, you know, into now all of their family being able to, you know, seeing the changes in them, where they put away their music, they put away their drugs, they put alcohol, just their whole lifestyle, learning to get along and what. How to be in a relationship. All of that, too. You know, it's like job, you know, a whole restoration.

[01:00:21] Brenda: Right, exactly.

[01:00:22] Jan: You know, and given. Yeah, more too.

[01:00:24] Brenda: Yeah, exactly.

[01:00:25] Jan: Yeah, yeah.

[01:00:26] Brenda: I was thinking about romans 15 seven. It says, therefore, welcome one another as Christ has welcomed you for the glory of God. And that's what we need to be doing to everybody that crosses our path.

[01:00:39] Jan: Yeah. Yeah. What? I'm just grateful that she was willing to be vulnerable and to share this with us because there's always in her story. I'm sure many people will be touched, right?

[01:00:53] Brenda: Absolutely. People need to hear these kind of stories.

[01:00:56] Jan: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, it's about time to close up. And thank you, Brenda.

[01:01:02] Brenda: Thanks for inviting me on.

[01:01:08] Jan: Thanks so much for listening. I look forward to sharing another transforming story with you next week.